need help in a few areas

Vehicle specific forum for tuning the Foxbody Chassis Mustangs utilizing decipha's GUFX Strategy

need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Tue May 05, 2020 8:16 pm

first is start up enrichment. as soon as my wideband reads it shows 12afr and takes quite a while to lean out. If I understand the write-up correctly it should read 14.1afr until it kicks into closed loop. Do I increase or decrease the numbers in the startup enrichment table to pull fuel out?

After I dial in startup enrichment I expect to need to make changes to the isc multiplier as I have higher rpm on startup then whats commanded. Will increasing or decreasing these numbers reduce rpm?

last for now is I have a hanging idle that I cant seem to figure out. I have played with dashpot a bit and the rpms fall nicely but they hang at 1100 or so until I come to a complete stop. If I free rev it sitting still they fall back nicely but anytime while decelerating and coasting to a stop they will hang. I notice that dashpot is staying at .5 right until vsbar switches to 0 and then it will fall along with the rpm.
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Wed May 06, 2020 12:57 am

no it should not read 14.1

First you should have your wideband in lambda. Anything .85 to 1 is fine for startup enrichment. Hence the enrichment part. If you want to lean it out you simply reduce the value in the cell where its rich in the startup enrichment table.

you reduce the isc multiplier value to reduce the air. You'll note the multiplier values are significantly higher when cold than when warm.

enable the dasctl patch to allow dashpot to decay while moving still.
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Wed May 06, 2020 6:53 am

the way I previously thought this should work was to have the wideband trend with the commanded startup lambse which I am currently in the ball park. Getting back into things this year I re-read the write-ups and thats how my mindset changed. "The ONLY way to properly dial in this table is to start the engine while cold and adjust the current
cell in use so the wideband reports near 14:1 until the engine has reaching operating temperature." That sentence is copied directly from the write-up

I will get my wideband changed to read lambda, I tried to change it the other day but I couldn't connect to the gauge for some reason.

Thanks for the clarification on which direction to go adjusting these tables. I am still struggling with these larger tables, startup enrichment, isc multiplier, and the spark table all come to mind. Some of these cells are only active for a short time so there is a small window to make the correction. I also get hung up on how nicely they trend from bigger numbers down to smaller numbers. I keep thinking if one cell needs a significant change all the cells around it should change to keep the numbers trending nicely like they are to start.

and finally the one part of your response I thought was easy, just enable a patch, welp I cant seem to find it. I searched and then went through the list of every patch in there and dont see dasctl. I took the car in one of those new social distancing car parades for a friends birthday. There were alot of cars so it was a slow creep for quite a while. The car hung there at 1100 rpms just about the whole time cuz I was never coming to a complete stop lol.

I am happy to report that the car runs very well other then the minor things above on the a9l2 base tune with all of my fueling inputs. I have done a couple WOT pulls and think I could add some more timing up top but as outlined above I need to get a better handle adjusting these larger table before doing anything with spark. It's quite noticeable how much more spark it has especially in the cruising ranges from my previous tune.
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Wed May 06, 2020 1:12 pm

yea ideally in a perfect world it should just rich of stoich which is what i was implying there. .85 to .95 is fine though the colder it is the more enrichment you will need to make it as smooth.

Those are the 3 main tables in the ecu for custom tuning. Nope no need in a nice trend make large adjustments if that's what you engine wants.

you might be using an older gufx xdf which doesn't have the dasctl. The latest one in downloads should have it in there if it doesn't let me know and I'll post a new xdf.
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Wed May 06, 2020 1:49 pm

I did some more searching after I posted and think I found it, it's not a patch though? ISC rpm control min speed - MINMPH(DASCTL)? Found info in a few other threads too about reducing this from 4.0 to .5, is this what you are talking about?

I did go ahead and download the latest files and I come up with the same thing.
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Wed May 06, 2020 3:32 pm

Had a small window to get the car out before the weather turns to crap for what looks like another week and it doesn't seem like the change I mentioned above has helped at all.
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Wed May 06, 2020 4:12 pm

no its my dasctl code i wrote

post your tune file and ill patch it
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Wed May 06, 2020 4:22 pm

Here it is, thanks man!
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Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Thu May 07, 2020 11:22 am

so I have got in a few cold starts in the garage and have made some progress with leaning it out and reducing rpms. Thing is though it seems any time I change fn1361 and fn1861 the car then doesnt want to go into closed loop? just now I let it startup and do its thing for almost 3 mins and it stayed in open loop. I finally tipped the throttle and it went into closed for a second but then went back to open and stayed there. I have made what I feel are big adjustments to the tables but its what its taken for the car to respond. I attached both tables with the areas ive changed highlighted.
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Thu May 07, 2020 7:59 pm

neither of those affect closed loop. As a side affect if its leaned too much and the hegos dont switch then it wont go in to closed loop. but it wouldnt be dropping in and out of closed loop.

here you go updated to the latest a9l2

updated xdf also
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06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Fri May 08, 2020 10:33 am

that was my assumption as well. I dont believe thats the case since I've finally just got the wideband to be at .85 when it first starts to read, I had to cut the numbers on the startup table more then in half just to get it there. I will have to spend some more time with it and see where I'm at.

Thanks for the updated files. First thing I did was searched dasctl and as expected I see the patch and its enabled, nice! Then I continue to search thru the bin comparing things and thats where I start to find differences that I am not expecting? I read recently about the updates to scaling to make that easier so I am starting to understand seeing some of those differences, but even the scaling percentage in this tune is different then the one I originally used? I have noticed some parameters actually being different too, such as byples is set at 60 instead of 15 like the tune that I sent. I see more as well but dont want this post to get stupid long.

Now if I open the tune I posted with the new xdf everything seems to be set to how I had it but the scaling is still present so the scaled numbers read different then what I've become used to. Changing the scaling percentage back to 1 takes care of it but then all the compare bins are still showing the scaled numbers. I just did that for shits and giggles trying to get a handle on what im seeing here.

startup enrichment looks the exact same but isc multiplier seems to be setup quite different? I also noticed fn035a has been added and seems to have more resolution then original fn035.

hoping to get some clarity on what's going on here and what .bin I should use going forward.
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Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Fri May 08, 2020 12:13 pm

you cant dial in startup enrichment til fuel is dialed in. Make sure your fuel error is as close to 0 as you can get it.

the scaling percentage cant be different since you have 60lb injectors. What were you expecting it to be?

those background changes qre just the latest a9l2 values. They dont affect anything.

the scaling for the isc multiplier is one of the background changes. It gives more resolution how it is now.

why would u not use the latest bin?
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91 4r70w - Skarlett
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93 auto - Danika
94 5spd Rionda
95 auto Aisha
Vehicle 2 Information: Others:
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06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Fri May 08, 2020 2:08 pm

I am as sure as I can be that my fuel is dialed in.

I did my scaling percentage as per the fuel write-up where I took the max flow of my maf and divided it by the 55 lb/min thats listed. That gave me a scaling percentage of 1.767 so seeing 2.009 in that tune confused me. I am now concerned that I did that wrong, I've had it that way since last summer.

I really hope my last question didnt come off shitty, after re-reading it I could see maybe it could, if so my bad. I will spend more time with the new bin and xdf. I am still very new to this so seeing things look different freaked me out.
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Fri May 08, 2020 4:31 pm

no you must have been mistaken cuz your injector high slope was scaled in half iirc
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91 4r70w - Skarlett
92 (2x) 5spd & auto - Bianqa, Andrea
93 auto - Danika
94 5spd Rionda
95 auto Aisha
Vehicle 2 Information: Others:
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00 Explorer 5L - Bernyce
07 GMC 2500HD 6L - Veranafer
06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Fri May 08, 2020 5:24 pm

I am unsure of alot of this tuning stuff but this I am sure lol. Double checked and high slope is 34.108
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Fri May 08, 2020 6:06 pm

yep. your scaling percentage was 1.76 now its 2.00

it doesn't make any difference the new gufx xdf shows unscaled values so you see actual so you have the same values either way.
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91 4r70w - Skarlett
92 (2x) 5spd & auto - Bianqa, Andrea
93 auto - Danika
94 5spd Rionda
95 auto Aisha
Vehicle 2 Information: Others:
00 Lincoln LS - Luanda
98 Camaro SS - Bounquisha
02 Harley F-150 - Sasasha
03 Marauder - DyShyKy
00 Explorer 5L - Bernyce
07 GMC 2500HD 6L - Veranafer
06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Sat May 09, 2020 6:41 am

Man this finally just clicked into my little brain this morning, now I understand the difference in numbers. Was hoping to get the car out and try the updates today but woke up to SNOW on the ground!!

Decipha have you ever thought about adding descriptions on how to use the histograms to the write-ups? Just did some searching and found a post on how to use it for fn035 but also curious on how to use it for the isc multiplier.

Also now that fn035a is used and has quite a bit more points can the histo be changed to have all of those points?

Once fn035a is dialed in is it normal or ok to hit 2.0 perload at wot on a boosted engine?
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Sat May 09, 2020 1:44 pm

yep 2.0 perload is common

one day ill add details for the histograms
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91 4r70w - Skarlett
92 (2x) 5spd & auto - Bianqa, Andrea
93 auto - Danika
94 5spd Rionda
95 auto Aisha
Vehicle 2 Information: Others:
00 Lincoln LS - Luanda
98 Camaro SS - Bounquisha
02 Harley F-150 - Sasasha
03 Marauder - DyShyKy
00 Explorer 5L - Bernyce
07 GMC 2500HD 6L - Veranafer
06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Sun May 10, 2020 8:16 am

loaded the latest bin and did a cold start this morning and happy to report this is the best the car has started for me yet. had about .87 on the wideband when it first read and then slowly leaned out. rpms didnt follow absolutely perfectly but alot closer then I've had them previously. log is attached in case anyone wants to view it and shoot me any recommendations.

she switched into closed loop right at 60 seconds and stayed which is good. only thing i noticed is the fuel was way far off and kept bringing itself in as temp increased, this can be seen in the log. is this normal or does this mean my maf curve down low possibly still needs work?
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Sun May 10, 2020 11:11 am

as the fuel write up states fuel can only be dialed in on a warm stabilized engine. The fuel error doesnt matter when its cold or warming up.

If there was a fuel error when warm you need to dial it in. If not then your all good.
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91 4r70w - Skarlett
92 (2x) 5spd & auto - Bianqa, Andrea
93 auto - Danika
94 5spd Rionda
95 auto Aisha
Vehicle 2 Information: Others:
00 Lincoln LS - Luanda
98 Camaro SS - Bounquisha
02 Harley F-150 - Sasasha
03 Marauder - DyShyKy
00 Explorer 5L - Bernyce
07 GMC 2500HD 6L - Veranafer
06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Tue May 12, 2020 12:18 pm

just had the car out for quite a while and still dealing with the hanging rpms, the dasctl patch hasnt made a change at all. dashpot just hangs there at .5 until I come to a complete stop then will slowly return to zero along with rpms coming down. I have tried changing dashpot decay and it doesnt seem to have an effect, rpms drop nicely right until that 11-1200 mark. any suggestions on what else I can try?
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Tue May 12, 2020 4:57 pm

if .5 dashpot is too much reduce dasmin
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91 4r70w - Skarlett
92 (2x) 5spd & auto - Bianqa, Andrea
93 auto - Danika
94 5spd Rionda
95 auto Aisha
Vehicle 2 Information: Others:
00 Lincoln LS - Luanda
98 Camaro SS - Bounquisha
02 Harley F-150 - Sasasha
03 Marauder - DyShyKy
00 Explorer 5L - Bernyce
07 GMC 2500HD 6L - Veranafer
06 Chrysler 300 AWD - Sharifa

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Wed May 13, 2020 12:00 pm

dasmin was the ticket! thanks for the tip!

still having trouble with dialing in the isc multiplier table for cold starts, warm re-starts and all else seems good. main issue is once it fires off rpms drop enough to almost stall the engine but it catches itself and then overshoots dsdrpm. I could even live without it matching spot on but the rpms were excessive before so been trying to bring them down. How do I use the ipsibr value to make adjustments to the table? Also I have saw isckam's being mentioned for this, is that something that exists only in newer strats?
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Wed May 13, 2020 4:38 pm

if it fires off and the rpms drop quickly its not getting enough air or startup fueling is too far off

ipsibr is the isc correction to maintain idle rpm. If it goes positive increase the cells value if it goes negative decrease it.
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Wed May 13, 2020 4:59 pm

awesome thanks. I have made some incorrect corrections previously so I think the isc table is what needs work. Once it caught itself isc duty cycle was pegged at .98 and ispibr climbed to .800. Its actually in the positive most of the time on startup.

Does the value of ispibr correlate with the correction to make, like should I add .8 to the cell where it first fired off?
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Wed May 13, 2020 8:04 pm

no its two different values. But if its at .8 you need to add at leasat .8 to it lol
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Thu May 21, 2020 11:36 am

so i have my startups dialed in nicely. still having the issue of going lean out of shifts when i first start driving it, to the point of having to really feather the throttle to prevent bucking. I realized the hego isnt switching early on so im pretty sure its not heating up quickly enough. I have delayed closed loop on cold and warm starts to both 120 secs and it has helped. This morning though even after the 2 minute mark when it switched into closed loop i had the symptom for the first few shifts.

Wondering if this is a common issue with turbo cars? My hego is within just a few inches of the turbo but feet away from the engine. If it is common and the only remedy is delaying CL then is it common to have to delay more then 120 secs?

If its not that common what else should i look into adjusting? once you are through the first few shifts it doesnt happen anymore. I still see the wideband swing rich at clutch in then lean at clutch out but not nearly as much of a swing and if you didnt look at the gauge you would never know. I have adjusted the transients which has seemed to lessen the swing when warm but not enough to help when cold.

never thought id say this but this is the last thing to sort out and my car will be tuned!!
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
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stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Thu May 21, 2020 3:33 pm

just keep plugging away at transient fuel
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Thu May 21, 2020 4:10 pm

ok will do, knew i shouldnt have mentioned being done tuning just yet lol

I will have to do some searching on the topic as I dont see anything about transients in the write-ups

all i have done so far is play with the 3 multipliers and honestly not real sure which way i should be adjusting them. thinking there has to be more to it then just the multipliers
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Thu May 21, 2020 5:49 pm

the tsief table. Reduce the values in the areas where it goes rich.

first if it goes rich on stabs of the throttle go reduce the aem scalar.
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:46 am

still havent been able to sort this out, made some small progress but not enough to be satisfied with.

a quick stab of the throttle does show the wideband go rich so I reduced the aem scaler all the way down to .1. This helps out with that and lessen the swings on shifts but just yesterday I noticed this is effecting the throttle response. I would describe it as a slight delay after the throttle is pressed before the rpms increase. Having this scaler set to 1 completely eliminates that

I have continued to work down the tsief table and did so to the point the car really did not like it, so I had no choice but to go back to the previous settings.

current adjustments I have made to try to get this sorted are as follows, metra set to .1, meftrd set to 2, transient fuel multiplier set to .3, manifold slow fill set to .2, along with bringing down the tsief table a bunch

its happening even in the 2 minutes of open loop, if I dont accelerate evenly and moderately it will go lean and break up. Once I get it settled in gear the wideband reads right around 1 until the next shift.

more suggestions on what else to try please!
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
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stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Mon Jun 01, 2020 9:35 am

the accel enrichment table fn1303 ?? is where you make more defined changes for the aem scalar. You can reduce the values at higher tar to help out while keeping the low tar where shes happy already.

accel enrichment is only for 1/10th of a second after positive pedal movement

transient enrichment handles the rest for losad changes.

Transient only makes up 10% of fuel. If fuel is varying more than that then its your maf that needs to be dialed in at that imaf point. Which is what it sounds like.
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Mon Jun 01, 2020 11:12 am

yep fn1303 is right, thanks for the details on adjusting it. I assume tar refers to degrees per second? so I should be adjusting the right half of this table?

Yea I feel like this is something bigger then accel enrichment or transients. I have been confident my maf curve is very close but I just spent some time double checking it. I did make some adjustments but nothing more then 3%. I have attached the before and after snips of the maf histo and fuel error histo. After my adjustment the maf histo looks perfect to me. I am not real sure how to read the fuel error histo though, considering I have dekas I havent paid much attention to it cuz my injectors shouldnt need any adjusting. Does anything in these 2 histos disagree with that thinking?
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Mon Jun 01, 2020 1:34 pm

that's all going to be pretty useless

you need to hold the imaf count where it occurs at and see what the error is
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Mon Jun 01, 2020 2:25 pm

but its only happening enough to be a problem when the engine is cold. with the engine warm and holding steady at the 25 increment imaf counts the curve looks to be well dialed in
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby decipha » Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:21 pm

if it only occurs when cold then either startup enrichment needs to be dialed in or if its in closed loop you need to kick up transients or accel enrichment. Go kick it up in the cell where it occurs at.
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 7:13 am

its happening in both OL and CL. its much worse if i allow it to switch into CL at the stock 60 sec mark.

I thought i had startup enrichment dialed in but only with no throttle input. once i start to apply throttle i have to be smooth and easy otherwise it tries to go lean and break up, it has the same symptom on every shift for the few minutes of run time. if i try a quick throttle stab ill get a big delay before rpms increase. if it was a startup enrichment issue then it wouldnt be present in CL as well right?

from previous suggestion i have been reducing values in the tsief table, should i be increasing them? honestly these adjustments seem to have little effect and from a few posts back i feel like this issue is bigger then just transients or accel enrichment.

this tuning stuff has been such a roller coaster for me. I make some progress and gain confidence then hit a wall again and think i should throw in the towel, become a premium member and turn it over to the expert lol. i enjoy the challenge and the satisfaction when progress is made but barely making any progress on this 20 something cold starts later is fucking frustrating lol.
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siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby canuck1 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 9:11 am

Stick with it Paul! My n/a setup isn't nearly as complex as what you're trying to tune but you seem to have a knack for figuring this stuff out. I understand the frustration, trust me! I've screwed up understanding how things work more times than I can count. I get through one element and the next hurdle trips me up, but I ain't letting no 30 year old computer beat me!! No greater satisfaction than finally squashing that last bug yourself and the sound of success that follows!

Sean
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Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 9:53 am

Thanks for the encouragement Sean! Your response also gave me a laugh, thanks for that as well. I have followed your threads closely to try to provide any help that i can, albeit a small chance i know enough to contribute, but also because i sympathize with the struggles.
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

Re: need help in a few areas

Unread postby PaulC-turbo5.0 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 9:57 am

did some searching of the forums and i came across a thread or two with similar symptoms and dashpot was mentioned as the possible culprit. when i was trying to figure out the hanging idle i had i reduced the values in fn882, dashpot airmass max clip. is it possible thats my problem or even a part of the problem?
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Vehicle Information: 1989 Mustang GT Convertible 5.0, GUFX/A9L2, TP RT, Moates Quarterhorse & Jaybird
Stock 302, stock cam, stock E7 heads, felpro 9333pt1 head gaskets and ARP studs, GT40 upper and lower-upper reversed
siemens deka 60's, stock lines, in tank 255lph pump
3" PMAS HPX slot
stock T5 with ram clutch, 3.55 gears
67mm On3 ceramic BB turbo, custom 2.5" stainless hotside built by me, custom 3" cold side through On3 intercooler, 10psi
custom 3" downpipe into 2.5" cat back with mac flowpath mufflers

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