Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

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m-barans
Posts: 87
Joined: 2021 Feb 16, 23:09
Location: Lafayette, Oregon US
Vehicle Information: 2003 Mercury Marauder 300A with new stock bore IRON 4.6 block, Manley crank, Manley H-tuff h-beam rods, CP pistons with stainless rings, ARP head studs, GT500 lash adjusters and rollers, D series cylinder heads, VMP GEN3R 2.65 L TVS blower, 80 lb/hr FRPP Siemens Deka injectors, HPX slot 100mm MAF, coyote mustang fuel pump with Holley 60 psi filter/regulator return at pump, Stainless works long tube headers and complete exhaust, Moates quarter horse and TunerPro RT with support from Decipha, RZASA strategy.

2001 Ford Lightning SVT F-150 stock engine w/ inlet ported M112, GT500 rollers, ARP head studs, metco quick change upper pulley with stock sized upper, K&N intake system, bassani SS exhaust system from the stock manifold flanges back. 4x4 trans oil pan. SSBC big brakes 14” up front. Work/Street truck. My “next to build” with trick flow heads (before extinction) with h-beams & cobra jet crank (sitting in tool box) and proper pistons. Next up after the marauder is dialed in.

Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by m-barans »

So sometimes my 1-2 shift is so retarded/delayed that the rev limiter is hit and the car stops accelerating of course until the shift is made. My first thought was the main control/ valve body but now I’m thinking it’s maybe a broken 1/2 accumulator spring or something. What to check? Should I buy the violet and light blue springs for the 1/2 accumulator? The trans only has 60k on it currently. I’d like to have minimal down time. Can I yank a newer 4R75 valve body from a yard and potentially use that if needed? Im not looking for anything super aggressive shift kit wise but open to suggestions for my 03 marauder trans. Thanks
decipha
Posts: 4899
Joined: 2021 Feb 15, 12:23
Location: Metairie, LA
Vehicle Information: Work Truck
'19 F-150 3.3L

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by decipha »

the 1-2 shift can be made as firm as you want in stock form no problem.

Go kick up the 1-2 tv pressure table
Blocmi
Posts: 26
Joined: 2021 Feb 16, 11:13
Location: Connecticut
Vehicle Information: 1995 Mustang GT, CBAZA, 11:1 306, Ported Windsor Sr. aluminum heads 2.02/1.60, Trick Flow Track Heat, 24lb injectors, Comp cams 294/306 (2,800-7,000), Shorty headers, X-Pipe, Reverse Manual VB C4, 4100 stall converter, 4:10, MT ET Drag 26-10-15

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by Blocmi »

Did you change rear gears?
Many people run into this problem when going to a higher rear gear ratio. I suppose it could happen with more power as well...
It's all about clutch fill time vs how fast your rpm is climbing.

IIRC there are a couple options to remedy.
1. Command the shift at a lower rpm so the clutch has more time to fill...
2. Enlarge a hole in the valve body separator plate to allow the intermediate clutch to fill more quickly.

Keep in mind, the 1-2 factory aluminum accumulator is known to wear out quickly on early transmissions, if yours is a 2003, it may have the bonded rubber already. If you're pulling the pan, it can be checked and or replaced with a bonded rubber replacement without dropping anything else.

I found the TCCoa forums (Thunderbird car club) has a wealth of information on AODE/4R70w mechanical function, issues, troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying. https://www.tccoa.com/forums/automatic- ... sions.990/
decipha
Posts: 4899
Joined: 2021 Feb 15, 12:23
Location: Metairie, LA
Vehicle Information: Work Truck
'19 F-150 3.3L

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by decipha »

No need in doing any of that just simply kick up the 1-2 as stated in the previous post
m-barans
Posts: 87
Joined: 2021 Feb 16, 23:09
Location: Lafayette, Oregon US
Vehicle Information: 2003 Mercury Marauder 300A with new stock bore IRON 4.6 block, Manley crank, Manley H-tuff h-beam rods, CP pistons with stainless rings, ARP head studs, GT500 lash adjusters and rollers, D series cylinder heads, VMP GEN3R 2.65 L TVS blower, 80 lb/hr FRPP Siemens Deka injectors, HPX slot 100mm MAF, coyote mustang fuel pump with Holley 60 psi filter/regulator return at pump, Stainless works long tube headers and complete exhaust, Moates quarter horse and TunerPro RT with support from Decipha, RZASA strategy.

2001 Ford Lightning SVT F-150 stock engine w/ inlet ported M112, GT500 rollers, ARP head studs, metco quick change upper pulley with stock sized upper, K&N intake system, bassani SS exhaust system from the stock manifold flanges back. 4x4 trans oil pan. SSBC big brakes 14” up front. Work/Street truck. My “next to build” with trick flow heads (before extinction) with h-beams & cobra jet crank (sitting in tool box) and proper pistons. Next up after the marauder is dialed in.

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by m-barans »

Blocmi wrote: 2021 Jul 02, 10:25 Did you change rear gears?
Many people run into this problem when going to a higher rear gear ratio. I suppose it could happen with more power as well...
It's all about clutch fill time vs how fast your rpm is climbing.

IIRC there are a couple options to remedy.
1. Command the shift at a lower rpm so the clutch has more time to fill...
2. Enlarge a hole in the valve body separator plate to allow the intermediate clutch to fill more quickly.

Keep in mind, the 1-2 factory aluminum accumulator is known to wear out quickly on early transmissions, if yours is a 2003, it may have the bonded rubber already. If you're pulling the pan, it can be checked and or replaced with a bonded rubber replacement without dropping anything else.

I found the TCCoa forums (Thunderbird car club) has a wealth of information on AODE/4R70w mechanical function, issues, troubleshooting, rebuilding, and modifying. https://www.tccoa.com/forums/automatic- ... sions.990/
Thanks for the information. I always appreciated the Supercoupe guys since my first one (95 auto SC) I purchased a 90 5 speed SC which was even more fun but those cars got me hooked on PD blower boost! I’m going to work on tuning the electronic control end before I drop the pan. I’d like to avoid mechanically altering the trans/ shift kit
m-barans
Posts: 87
Joined: 2021 Feb 16, 23:09
Location: Lafayette, Oregon US
Vehicle Information: 2003 Mercury Marauder 300A with new stock bore IRON 4.6 block, Manley crank, Manley H-tuff h-beam rods, CP pistons with stainless rings, ARP head studs, GT500 lash adjusters and rollers, D series cylinder heads, VMP GEN3R 2.65 L TVS blower, 80 lb/hr FRPP Siemens Deka injectors, HPX slot 100mm MAF, coyote mustang fuel pump with Holley 60 psi filter/regulator return at pump, Stainless works long tube headers and complete exhaust, Moates quarter horse and TunerPro RT with support from Decipha, RZASA strategy.

2001 Ford Lightning SVT F-150 stock engine w/ inlet ported M112, GT500 rollers, ARP head studs, metco quick change upper pulley with stock sized upper, K&N intake system, bassani SS exhaust system from the stock manifold flanges back. 4x4 trans oil pan. SSBC big brakes 14” up front. Work/Street truck. My “next to build” with trick flow heads (before extinction) with h-beams & cobra jet crank (sitting in tool box) and proper pistons. Next up after the marauder is dialed in.

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by m-barans »

decipha wrote: 2021 Jul 03, 20:35 No need in doing any of that just simply kick up the 1-2 as stated in the previous post
So I believe I found the TV pressure 1-2 shift table. Looks like output is PSI. I’m guessing I should add maybe 5 in the areas with higher TP rel. Maybe blend that in the table so it still ramps nicely? I will give that a try and see how it improves and report back. Thanks
034v
Posts: 91
Joined: 2021 Feb 22, 09:00
Location: Dallas TX
Vehicle Information: 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC - Custom Turbocharged
1989 Lincoln Mark VII LSC - Custom Turbocharged --- SOLD
2013 Ford F150 FX2 - 3.5L Ecoboost
2019 Explorer Sport - 3.5L Ecoboost

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by 034v »

In the TV tables, 650+ TP make 99.
Max TV scalars are around 95
No less than 10 so you don't get drop-out
decipha
Posts: 4899
Joined: 2021 Feb 15, 12:23
Location: Metairie, LA
Vehicle Information: Work Truck
'19 F-150 3.3L

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by decipha »

No, absolutely do not do that as it will bang so hard you'll eventually destroy the transmission and or break stuff.

Most marauders I put the 1-2 shift pressure at around 30 psi. If its boosted you can kick it up in the 40s. Much more than that and you'll need an MRI and a neck brace if you manage to keep traction.
034v
Posts: 91
Joined: 2021 Feb 22, 09:00
Location: Dallas TX
Vehicle Information: 1996 Lincoln Mark VIII LSC - Custom Turbocharged
1989 Lincoln Mark VII LSC - Custom Turbocharged --- SOLD
2013 Ford F150 FX2 - 3.5L Ecoboost
2019 Explorer Sport - 3.5L Ecoboost

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by 034v »

decipha wrote: 2021 Jul 07, 15:46 No, absolutely do not do that as it will bang so hard you'll eventually destroy the transmission and or break stuff.

Most marauders I put the 1-2 shift pressure at around 30 psi. If its boosted you can kick it up in the 40s. Much more than that and you'll need an MRI and a neck brace if you manage to keep traction.
Ah.. nevermind lol. Not on them. didn't fully read it was a Marauder. my bad.

I was thinking Mark VIII without a Jmod.
m-barans
Posts: 87
Joined: 2021 Feb 16, 23:09
Location: Lafayette, Oregon US
Vehicle Information: 2003 Mercury Marauder 300A with new stock bore IRON 4.6 block, Manley crank, Manley H-tuff h-beam rods, CP pistons with stainless rings, ARP head studs, GT500 lash adjusters and rollers, D series cylinder heads, VMP GEN3R 2.65 L TVS blower, 80 lb/hr FRPP Siemens Deka injectors, HPX slot 100mm MAF, coyote mustang fuel pump with Holley 60 psi filter/regulator return at pump, Stainless works long tube headers and complete exhaust, Moates quarter horse and TunerPro RT with support from Decipha, RZASA strategy.

2001 Ford Lightning SVT F-150 stock engine w/ inlet ported M112, GT500 rollers, ARP head studs, metco quick change upper pulley with stock sized upper, K&N intake system, bassani SS exhaust system from the stock manifold flanges back. 4x4 trans oil pan. SSBC big brakes 14” up front. Work/Street truck. My “next to build” with trick flow heads (before extinction) with h-beams & cobra jet crank (sitting in tool box) and proper pistons. Next up after the marauder is dialed in.

Re: Late 1-2 shift intermittently 4R70W

Unread post by m-barans »

Ok, thanks for the information. I made some changes to the 1-2 shift but not really finding the results so I will investigate the mechanics of it after I get the car running again. The 03 cobra eaton needs a freshening up (noisy rotor pack) so she is disabled for the time being. Updates to come
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