Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

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Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Thu Jun 22, 2017 4:40 pm

I managed to damage my block, not badly but I try to make everything as good as I can. Block needs boring, boring need torque plates, and eventually fixing isn't cheap. So if I use bunch of money to fix it, why don't I make it better.
If I bore and fix current engine, na version with little bigger c/r costs almost as much than readily available iron block filled with bullet proof goodies. The problems: ready short block is with 18cc dished pistons, so it would need some kind of charger, c/r is 8.5:1.
I can't afford one right now, can engine be timed and tuned so it will be driveable? Terminator Eaton swap would be nice, and so is turbo/s. Eaton and iron block does add weight, turbos could be cheaper to build.
Among other things, I'd like to drive my car soon, it's been two years in garage and motivations is disappearing.
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby SlowBox » Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:46 pm

Are you asking if an engine you build you can also tune yourself? Yes, absolutely. A low compression blower or turbo car would probably be easier to tune than a high compression NA motor.
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Fri Jun 23, 2017 2:58 am

That too, I'm having hard time choosing which way to go. NA engine could be better daily, but I loved to drive wifes SC Tbird.
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:36 am

the 4v engines do not like compression, its best to build a 9:1 engine 4v and toss boost on it
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:59 am

I'm getting build iron block with 8.5:1 cr
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:48 am

cool, I always 20lbs on the 4v's if you stick with pump gas
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:38 pm

I have block now, if only I had more time for installing. I got injectors too, 47 lbs Gt500 set.
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:50 am

that was a bad move, any healthy boosted 4v will peg 47lb injectors very easily, should have 80s or larger
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:04 pm

I'm only looking for 450-500hp, and use it as daily driver
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:14 pm

ah i c, cool no prob then
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:20 am

How can I mount knock sensors outside block. There are no places between heads. There is extra threads near engine mounts but on the other side it is rather low. I'd like to use all eec capabilities.


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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:03 am

they valley seems to be the most ideal location, some have mounted them on the heads though, ive never strayed from the stock location so i wont be of any help
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Fri Sep 15, 2017 1:39 pm

I just made deal from Terminator Eaton: charger, intake, heat exchanger, injectors, throttle body. Mainly all parts above block. I think I need to fabricate some brackets like in Trilogy's marauder kit. I plan to use my ecu and alternator.
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Fri Sep 15, 2017 7:37 pm

cool
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:36 pm

My luck, it was from 5.4 Lightning. Doesn't fit under hood or engine.
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Re: Mach1 32V opinions

Unread postby decipha » Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:40 pm

u know what u have to do
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Re: Mach1 32V project

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Thu Oct 26, 2017 11:49 pm

I got correct low miles Eaton with plenum, tb and cai. Saving for more parts, intake and cooler next. I moved knock sensors outside the block, near engine mounts. I may get terminator ecu later, but what should I use? Mach ecu has knock control, and terminator controls charger bypass solenoid. EGR will not be in use, so there is extra solenoid to use for. I ordered some heat shielding tube for knock sensor wiring, I must wait for them to get wiring made.

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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:30 am

the mach 1 ecu is fine if u already have it, i wouldnt go out of my way to find an 03/04 cobra ecu as they are nothing special. If its going in a 94-95 cobra and your keeping the original analog 94-95 gauge cluster you will want to get an 03/04 luxury sedan ecu as it has a tach output

the boost solenoid is rather useless but if dead set on it you can rewrite an unused pin to control it correctly
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:09 am

I have swapped whole powertrain from mach, including wiring and cluster. All wires were different, except tail lights. Wiring was some pounds lighter.
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:04 am

how long did swapping all the wiring take you?

might as well keep the mach ecu its fine
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:10 am

oh btw, i meant to post this before but it skipped my mind, a member here thats a shop owner who has some marauders hes boosting, the marauder same as the mach has the aluminum block with c heads and gargabe bottom end with higher compression ~10:1 so just as i told him ill post it here too as its relevant

decipha wrote:one thing worth noting, the marauders are high compression 4 valve engines, the 4v's do not like compression at all, I've had bone stock n/a marauders detonate with anything over 14 deg of timing at peak torque roughly 3700-4500 rpm or so. make sure you don't shoot any more than 8 degrees to her at peak tq with boost. Not to mention the marauders have junk powered rods and hyper pistons so they can't take much abuse. N/A they usually take about 19 deg of timing with premium on the big end and only 10 deg with regular on the big end. I wouldn't recommend anymore than 11 deg up top for safety with boost.
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:43 am

Good thing that I have decent short block
Build sheet :
4.6L Supercharged Short Block
Engine Block 1 Cast Iron 4.6L Engine Block
MAN-594220C-8 1 Manley 18CC Dished Pistons, 0,020"
MAN-14042R-8 1 Manley H-Beam Connecting Rods w/ARP 2000 Bolts
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CB-1442H 1 Clevite H Series Performance Rod Bearings
FR-M-6303-D46 1 Ford Racing Steel Cobra Crank 8-bolt
M-6600-D46 1 4.6L High Volume Oil Pump and Pickup Tube
MMR-BILLETGEARS 1 MMR Hurricane Billet Oil Pump Gears
ARP-156-5201 1 ARP Main Cap Side Bolt Kit
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Sun Oct 29, 2017 4:01 am

I had car rather dismantled, so wiring swap was easy. Door wiring must be swapped, different connectors. Front fenders was removed for motor swap so I painted engine bay and swapped wiring. Because I used crashed donor car, I had to make new brake lines for abs/traction control module. With carpet and dashboard out, I changed interior wiring, and installed new audio wiring. All audio components are changed. And welding better subframe connectors was safer.
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:55 pm

Cars starts and runs. No idle though. How can I read the original bin from ecm. I have Binary Editor 2010 but not correct strategy file, and new strategies can be only bought for new BE. I recently lost my job, so can't afford new licences atm. I have tried to learn Tunerpro RT, but looks like there is no read from ecu option. I have new adx and xdf, and seems like logging starts with base tune, but dashboard shows nothing. And log has only time running.
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:11 pm

I read stock bins from ecu's all the time in tunerpro

perhaps you missed the getting started write up on the homepage?

https://www.efidynotuning.com/started.htm
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Mon Nov 20, 2017 11:55 pm

I red it so many times but didn't understand, after good night sleep I got it :) I red the chip, and got this. I uploaded it in QH and car runs. Next thing to learn is datalogging. I applied universal datalogging patch, but everything in dash shows zeros. Here is unmodified bin ZYA2 strategy RYAK1

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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:12 am

did you write the tune to the qh after you applied the datalogging patch? are you using the correct QH eec-v adx from the homepage?
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:35 pm

Yes and yes. I patched the original bin, is that correct? Engine is in stock condition, only egr removed. IAC is broken, that's reason for no idle.
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:05 am

no you cannot patch the original bin it will just corrupt the tune

you have to use an fbfg2 or fbgi0 tune and modify it for your changes, the eec-v strategy swap thread will give u all the details

sym2 is the fbfg2 mach1 tune, prob easiest to plug that in, you can download it from the homepage
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:23 am

I tried to compare bins, but for example maf transfer values are very different. Does your xdf work only with your tunes. I thought that I copy basic settings from mach1 bin but I thought that won't work. I used search and copied pats code to sym2. Mach 1 has 24 lb injectors, are the values already in sym2, how about knock control?
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:06 am

sym2 is a stock bin for a mach1

no you cannot directly compare two different strategies, only software that i know of that will offer that is pcmtec since the tunes are saved as text files with values and the software extrapolates the bin at write time, but they are only supporting the powerpc crowd for initial release
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:38 am

I thought the were same strategy. What about the pats?
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:35 am

u specifically listed the strategy as ryak1 / zya2 bin

what about the pats?
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:28 pm

do I have transfer pats code to sym2 bin
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:06 pm

yes, just copy it from your stock tune to the new tune
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:36 am

I have mach 1 returnless fuel system with original pump. Is there suitable single pump that has enough flow when I get Eaton installed, or should I change to return style?
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:14 am

neither, stick with returnless and just toss a cobra hat or gt500 twin pump setup in it
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:44 am

They don't fit in mach tank, and whole tank gets expensive shipped to Finland. Maybe the bowl can be modded to take dual pumps.
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby decipha » Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:00 am

we had a 2010 procharged 3v GT here at the shop a few weeks ago. The stock pump was done at 350rwhp. The lead tech swapped in a spare 11-14 coyote pump and the car has been doing very well. It's not ideal as it's not a gerator pump but in a pinch will suffice.

you can look around and see what others have had success with on single pumps

my thinking is if Henry decided twin pumps we're needed on their boosted setups then who am I to disagree lol
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Re: Mach1 32V project, Eaton swap

Unread postby Pappacosworth » Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:32 am

Somebody suggested this, had 600 rwhp single setup https://www.aeromotiveinc.com/340-stealth/
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